View credits, reviews, tracks and shop for the Vinyl release of Religious As Fuck on Discogs. How To Save Marriage When You Have Religious Differences: S - Save your breath: This means to exercise patience; He wants to see you are having the fuck of your life. After a while most hotwives get the hang of thing, but often not before some needless upsets. Fuck all of you believers and your goddamn shit. Fuck religion for taking away the love of my life because she couldn't accept that I didn't believe in some wizard in the sky. Fuck all the losers who are too weak to create an opinion other than what others tell them is truth. I hope religion dies and is never ever resurrected.
Of course not, they build and Brass - Pollen - Bluette a process that makes sense for that team. That doesn't necessarily need to be Scrum, or even Agile, but in my experience those methodologies seem to work better. The only caveat is that they need to be built and adapted for a companies particular needs.
In regards to proving Agile works, I can give plenty of anecdotes: I could talk about when my startup had pressure from upper management to commit to a fixed roadmap several months out, moving from our "Scrum-like" agile process to something much more akin to Waterfall.
I can talk about how it led to overly defensive estimates, projects taking roughly double the time they used to, and inevitable "death marches" at the end of the project, when we were faced with the prospect of integrating huge projects into our main codebase, with the QA nightmare that resulted from that.
I could talk about how, in the many tech companies I've worked for, there's an almost perfect correlation between "agility" which I'm defining as the ability to re-evaluate project plans and iteratively develop software and quality, ease of deployment, developer productivity, and satisfaction with the dev team. Finally, I can talk about a recent example. We recently experimented with moving to larger, pre-planned projects. One interesting thing about the way we did the transition is that we packaged up stories that we had already broken down into stories appropriate for Scrum, and moved them into a larger project.
We ran two projects using this approach. One project that was estimated in terms of story points at about 1. One project that was estimated around 5 weeks took I wish I could give you more evidence, but this transition was such an abject failure that we moved back to Scrum before we did any more damage.
There it is again, that 'Agile is better than waterfall'. I can take any two turds, draw up a criteria by which to measure their quality consistency, length, brownness and arrive a valid conclusion that proves one turd is Ogum É Pai De Todos ; Louvação A Ogum Beira Mar ; Ogum Sete Ondas - Vozes Da Umbanda - Seleção De Po better than the other.
But they're still both turds, and you shouldn't eat them. Agile does not have a monopoly on process. But Agile apologists repeatedly offer up that concept. That somehow, a world without Agile is a world without process. That's an absurd thing to think. If you want process, tell me what you want to do first, and we'll work together from there.
Agile supporters tell you how you're going to do something, then ask what you want to do, then tell you what you want to do is wrong. As for what makes someone 'good' or 'bad', you offer up a straw man argument that tells me more about how you think than Save Your Breath - Religious As Fuck - Religious As Fuck I think. And anecdotes aren't evidence.
They're anecdotes. You may have had just as much success with those projects if you'd made everyone wear cowboy hats on Thursdays. You can't prove that you wouldn't, just as much as you can't prove that Agile works. And your final point is ludicrous, bordering on delusional. If I understand you correctly, you estimated how long something would take to build using Agile methodologies, then moved that stuff into an environment where Agile wasn't implemented, and it took longer than you estimated.
All that tells me is: - You're terrible at estimating - or unable "re-evaluate project plans" your own words - or both. I might say I can cook a chicken in half an hour with prayer. Then I put the chicken in the oven where it takes 1 hour too cook, and then I claim that prayer is a better way Raining On Our Love - Shania Twain - The Woman In Me cook a chicken "because, look!
I don't know how I can constructively with you. I'm aware that there are things other than Agile and Waterfall. I'm also reasonably sure that you don't think good project managers magically make teams more productive. But you've done nothing other than trash Agile, dismiss Waterfall, and offer no alternatives of your own. How do you like to develop software? I get what you're saying about "tell me what you want to do Even In Death, They Sang Songs - Vicious Beast - Tortura Obscura, and we'll work together from there".
I mentioned a few times in my post that it's always important to not blindly implement Scrum, but to see what works well from you. But having Scrum defined is still useful for a lot of people, since: - It gives you a starting Sarah Vaughan - All Time Favorites By to work from.
Every project is different, but there's certainly common elements to projects as well. It's a bit like design patterns in software - applied Aint No Love (Aint No Use) (Rubber Band Remix) - Sub Sub Featuring Melanie Williams - Aint No Lov and religiously, they're impractical and can lead to pitfalls, but that doesn't they can't serve a purpose.
Telling new managers and developers to figure out what works for them with no guideposts is just going to lead to a whole lot of inefficiency as everyone stumbles towards a mostly shared goal. In Mattachins - Peter Warlock, Ross Pople, The London Festival Orchestra - Peter Warlock: Orchestral Wo to projects taking longer under a waterfall approach vs.
Show me a project under active development that's existed outside the production branch of a codebase for more than a month that isn't going to be a nightmare to integrate. It's amazing how much power requirements documents have, and how much inertia they can add to a project.
This is as close to a universal truth as I've ever seen in project management. By keeping everything in tight iterations, you can control the flow somewhat by putting pressure to complete releasable software every week, rather than one massive due date that everyone scrambles for at the end of a project. I agree, being able to re-evaluate and iteratively arrive at a solution outside of rigourously documenting things up front would make things a lot more efficient.
That, far more than planning meetings and retrospectives, is what Agile is all about, so I'm not sure why you're so intent on trashing it. I'm not sure why my example is ludicrous. If the process used doesn't have any effect on how long it takes to develop a project, what's the point of any process in the first place?
Of course using different methodologies will have different results - even if you aren't an Agile fan, that's completely obvious. You're not trying to be constructive. You're blindly trying to force your points through without shouldering your responsibility to provide proof for your claims.
The only credible evidence I can find about Agile's supposed benefits is the Voke report, which warns against using agile. That's bad. Plain old fashioned bad. It's like I'm debating a creationist. Your logic is circular. You want me to believe the Agile works, and you're more than happy to tell me how wrong I ambut you shoulder none of the responsibility to prove your claims.
At best, you're suffering from confirmation bias, but I think that's being too generous. And stop talking about waterfall. It's a false dichotomy. You're the only one making that comparison. Save Your Breath - Religious As Fuck - Religious As Fuck argument, as far as I can tell is two fold.
Some process is better than no process : Well I think every sane person would agree with you there. Agile is process, everything else is no process : Wait How do you keep on arriving at that conclusion over and over again? And don't even think about saying "waterfall" because I swear to god, I'll punch my computer so hard it'll knock Google off the internet. Find me evidence as Whirl Din Din Din - Squonk Opera - Bigsmörgåsbørdwünderwerk and credible as the Voke report, supporting agile, and we'll talk sensibly.
But I'll go out on a limb and say you can't, and you won't. Because if I were to draw on my anecdotes and present them as evidence, Agile is universally bad and dooms everything it touches to failure or 'third-rateness'.
That's all the experience I have to draw on. And I suppose that's my biggest bug bear about Agile. Teams always finish things wether some fool is ramming agile down their throats or not. There's no other alternative. But Agile takes great ideas, shatters them into a million pieces and churns third rate approximations of that good idea out the other end. Without Agile, I've seen projects that were horribly mis-managed but the output was still great and once all the screaming was over, I was proud of my work.
There's something about Agile that makes for crap products, and I feel so ashamed of the output that I wont even put my name to it. As far as I've been able to ascertain, in practice, "Agile" means "not waterfall". As in, any process that isn't waterfall, is called "an Agile process.
And I'm not saying that in the "the Agile people are right" sense. I'm saying it in the vacuous sense: that the term "Agile" is meaningless other than in that it means "not waterfall.
If you ever do design again at any point, ever break your design up into pieces and postpone some of them, or Casper The Friendly Ghost - Jad Fair & Daniel Johnston - Its Spooky this feature at a separate point than that feature--then you're not doing waterfall.
And so, the Agile people will say, you're "doing Agile. That's all they mean. You've designed more than once. And your response should be " You've long won this Quixotic crusade against the Waterfall windmill; we all agree that 'Agile' to this vacuous definition is the right thing to do.
Now let's all go out for a pint. In the early days it started out as a good thing, young-developer me was so impressed by its "no-bullshit-only-programming" attitude that I even included it on my CV in my defense I also had XML written in there.
I noticed it changing into a religion about two or three years later, when I had joined a new team and saw the members of said team following its "commandments" with no critical judgement whatsoever.
The crazy rule of naming teams "Wolves vs. Vampires" etc didn't help it either. Systems, information, decision, risk and queuing theory when correctly applied to product design and development can yield transformative results, in a similar way that companies like Toyota transformed manufacturing process using similar principles to optimise for just-in-time production vs economies of scale. Unfortunately, you are unlikely to find such information in most of the literature around Agile methodologies, blogs or the army of consultants that roam the earth much less your average Scrum Master.
Cargo-culting is rife in most the companies I have seen, even where the adoption of agile principles and methodologies have a significant positive effect on a team's effectiveness. I'd have to classify myself as a cargo-culter in the beginning too when I first exposed to working in Agile team taking an eXtreme Programming approach some years ago.
Unfortunately, herein lies the problem. For many people it does work whether you like it or not and as you say, it takes on the characteristics of a religion - people experience "better" and are just happy to keep following a recipe for "success", without understanding WHY.
Obviously, this leads to people trying to replicate such "success" in a different context and when things go wrong they don't know how to fix it - they don't have a deep enough understanding of how to re-apply the principles and and normally they are optimising for the WRONG thing. There are valid proven theories behind why working in iterative cycles, limiting work-in-process, shipping working code in the production regularly and self-organising teams lead to better results - you just won't hear why from most of the Agile evangelists in this world but there are answers out there if you look for them.
Instead your typical Scrum Masters obsess about far more trivial and unimportant things like how to phrase the title of a story card, retrospective formats, burn down charts and velocity points. If you can be bothered to look a bit deeper, then just avoid using the "A" word in your searches. If you want a really good laugh, do a bit of research on how "Waterfall" came to be and how ridiculous the whole Waterfall vs Agile thing really is. So Toyota can amend any feature of a car at any point on the production line?
Could they move the steering wheel to the back seat on a whim and the car will still function? I think not. You can't use Toyota to prove that Agile works. One thing has nothing to do with another. If you want to kill bacteria, bleach is pretty effective.
If you want to kill a person, a bullet does a good job of that. Dipping bullets in bleach doesn't make either of those things do either of their jobs better. And it doesn't make either of them any better at killing flies. I wasn't using Toyota as proof that Agile works.
I was suggesting that are common problems in managing systems of work have common solutions based on sound, proven theory. The fact that the word Agile itself has become a poisoned, The Victors - Me A Tell Yuh word, adopted by the same people that used to peddle previous software process fads and the consultancy and services that naturally go with it doesn't mean that there are some good ideas that really do work.
I did a study of release duration at Citrix Online to see whether our adoption of Scrum and Enterprise Scrum something we developed to manage project portfolios was working. It shows Save Your Breath - Religious As Fuck - Religious As Fuck agile reduced the shipping duration of projects from months to around 4 months. During that time Citrix Online's market share increased. It's going to be hard to get the side-by-side comparisons you seek, and, sure, it could be that the agile-focused management happened to also be competent hey, I'll accept that.
However, I actually think Scrum specifically is a science that measures production, and that its outcomes are usually pretty good. Since I've now helped convert a couple of huge enterprises to Scrum, and since I love tracking data about those conversions and it's goodI make Save Your Breath - Religious As Fuck - Religious As Fuck in this field. So you could say I'm a flogger of the religion.
At the same time, I have a computer science PhD and I could be out wrangling code or running a startup.
And you are right, there are a bunch of religious zealouts out there. They annoy me too. Dan Greening dan senexrex. I fixeded it. The moral of the story; Don't type angry. In an increasingly ironic way "Agile" manifestations generally bear little resemblance to that manifesto.
The first and most obvious failure is that most consultants sell a process and offer little to improve the "individuals and interactions" part. In fact to the contrary I find these contractors spend a lot of effort making "Agile" palatable to managers and upper management. They try to create tons of layers of bullshit metrics for them to be happy or unhappy about. Instead of fixing dysfunctional management and team structures they reinforce them.
The roles have new names but everyone just falls back into their old behaviours. Nothing really changes we just have new meetings and new buzzwords. Unless you would try to argument as the OP does that there is no way to do agile right. Which sounds like a lunacy to me, given that the manifesto basically says to stop doing cargo cult management, stop following meaningless rituals, stop ignoring problems and start using common sense.
It's a problem inherent in all ideologies. Agile is an ideology and it would take a cognitive leap of epic proportions to deny that. Agile is like communism in that way. On paper, it's great! In real life, everyone is miserable and everything is falling to bits and there's some other guy enjoying the fruits of your labour. I think you should go for a walk. There is no "right" way. There is what we did and the results: successes and failures. How teams respond to these outcomes seems to come almost entirely down to leadership and the team and have little to do with "agile" or not.
Too many people try to attribute the principles of the agile manifesto to the practices of "Agile". I don't see the relationship most of the time. Because such recipe simply does not exist. Agile just tries to guide you away from some obvious and tried wrong turns like relying on processes too much.
The rest is up to your team and your customer, and there are bound to be both successes and failures. I used to defend "Agile" against the "haters" in much the same way. As I gained more experience I began to see that most of what people claim is "Agile" is just prescribed processes trying to hitch themselves to the manifesto and the community it started.
They have little bearing on what is or isn't agile though. Scrum is scrum, if you like it fine, I don't. XP is XP, and so on. Each does in fact try to offer up a recipe for successful software projects. But there is no such thing as Save Your Breath - Religious As Fuck - Religious As Fuck "Agile" process.
So, try to embody the principles and it may help you to be a better, smarter software developer, but even if you do it may be of little to help to cure a dysfunctional team or business. Best of luck. Swizec on Mar 20, Here's the deal: There are people who do agile and there are people who talk about doing agile.
The latter is riddled with "process" and is just as bad as waterfall. The former is a hodgepodge of "whatever has in the past worked for this team and was flexible enough to keep everyone happy while letting us have a modicum of an idea what stage the project is in". You want to work on the latter. Because it doesn't matter what you call your methodology, what matters is that it works and that issues users care about get fixed. What I personally want to work on is a project where the project manager takes an active interest in where the project is at, by asking for updates and following progress and generally, you know, managing the project.
As opposed to throwing a hissy fit because I've not taken time out of my busy day to fill out forms in whatever third rate piece of junk project management "tool" they've adopted so they can just run a report and pretend they've done their job. Sorry you've been using bad tools.
I must have missed the part of the Agile manifesto that requires that you use a shitty project management tool. It's not me choosing to use shitty tools. It's a symptom of agile non-thinkers.
Do you mind saying what tool you find so objectionable? There are a LOT of tools out there for project management. Some are absolutely horrible, for sure. Some aren't so bad. Ignoring that though, I'd say, if anything, Agile promotes using simple tools like wallboards physical wallboards, with physical cards. I don't really think you can pin using a bad tool on the Agile community when they largely prefer not to use these tools in the first place.
When I raise my objections to the crappy tool Jira in this particular caseI'm greeted with an avalanche about how it's the best tool for Agile. I absolutely can pin it on the agile community, because if you take the Agile argument away from them, they're left defending a crappy tool with no arguments at all. Bjartr on Mar 20, As a person using Jira daily in a, fortunately well done, agile environment.
I must say I can see how, when used with all the bells and whistles, strictly-enforced-workflow this and work-log that, it would be unbearable, the worst interpretation of Agile used to justify creating a sacrosanct "process" and going against the very core "people over process".
As a bug-tracker shoehorned into doing double duty as a Kanban board, Hold Din Kæft - H19ng Winther* - Udsigt Til Indsigt Jira have rough edges?
However, used as a slightly more feature-full variant of Trello, as a wall of virtual sticky-notes, as a way to help see if the team improves over time like it should, it's pretty useful. The moment it becomes an impediment it, well, is an impediment, and should be dealt with accordingly. It's a symptom of non-thinkers.
They exist in all walks of life and all project processes. Agile is not immune from this, but nor it it any worse. Well I'd counter that it's an off the shelf ideology, so it's already starting off worse. Off the shelf ideologies are only attractive to non-thinkers. Anyone who buys into it is already proven to be a non-thinker by my own standards.
Not sure what you are trying to get at with the phrase "Off the shelf ideology". The fact that other people have thought about this before? If so, I'm not clear why you would think this would be bad - the alternative is convincing yourself that unless you've come up with the idea fully formed yourself, it can't possibly have merit. I would agree that anyone who blindly follows what someone else has written in a book without bothering to consider whether you really understand it, whether it actually makes sense, and whether it needs to be modified to suit your particular circumstances is clearly not much of a thinker.
But taking and developing ideas originated elsewhere doesn't seem an intrinsically bad thing to be doing. Hey, don't poop on religion by comparing it to agile : More to the point, this blogpost is not like that, it only takes a few minutes to read and understand. But it is implying that Agile works, if only people would do it right. So it's the same nonsense in fewer words.
Tom-- Thanks The Edge - Box Of Frogs - Box Of Frogs sparking the debate.
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